1 00:00:00,620 --> 00:00:06,899 when she died or when her mother died 2 00:00:04,410 --> 00:00:10,070 the father died that they were at the 3 00:00:06,899 --> 00:00:14,849 Tilton school in New Hampshire and 4 00:00:10,070 --> 00:00:20,609 mother had to wrap up the farm and sell 5 00:00:14,849 --> 00:00:24,720 it and the money they got from that got 6 00:00:20,609 --> 00:00:29,189 them through high school basically it 7 00:00:24,720 --> 00:00:35,399 that they went to live with her uncle in 8 00:00:29,189 --> 00:00:39,600 Puyallup Washington that's how she got 9 00:00:35,399 --> 00:00:41,640 out to Washington and then went to the 10 00:00:39,600 --> 00:00:45,930 University of Washington got a master's 11 00:00:41,640 --> 00:00:48,360 degree in textiles and then from there 12 00:00:45,930 --> 00:00:52,289 she went to the University of Minnesota 13 00:00:48,360 --> 00:00:59,579 and taught at the University that's 14 00:00:52,289 --> 00:01:04,860 where she met my father not actually he 15 00:00:59,579 --> 00:01:10,130 was born in Tyndall South Dakota in a 16 00:01:04,860 --> 00:01:10,130 sod hood on the Prairie got a homestead 17 00:01:11,299 --> 00:01:16,560 broke finally went back to the family 18 00:01:14,760 --> 00:01:23,070 farm in southern Minnesota the dodge 19 00:01:16,560 --> 00:01:25,790 family car my grandmother was about so 20 00:01:23,070 --> 00:01:25,790 that's how they got 21 00:01:31,620 --> 00:01:40,680 in those conditions as well I think the 22 00:01:37,140 --> 00:01:43,350 big problem was of course he was going 23 00:01:40,680 --> 00:01:46,980 to tried to go to the University during 24 00:01:43,350 --> 00:01:49,230 the Depression and they had the money 25 00:01:46,980 --> 00:01:52,080 left to send him to undergraduate school 26 00:01:49,230 --> 00:01:56,640 and then he got help going on to 27 00:01:52,080 --> 00:01:58,490 graduate school and get this PhD but you 28 00:01:56,640 --> 00:02:00,900 know there weren't big scholarships then 29 00:01:58,490 --> 00:02:03,360 you either worked your way through or 30 00:02:00,900 --> 00:02:05,940 you had money or and of course the price 31 00:02:03,360 --> 00:02:09,110 wasn't anything like it is either so 32 00:02:05,940 --> 00:02:13,560 that's the other side of it but 33 00:02:09,110 --> 00:02:15,960 basically they have money enough to send 34 00:02:13,560 --> 00:02:17,430 the oldest to college see his younger 35 00:02:15,960 --> 00:02:20,700 brother didn't have the chance to go 36 00:02:17,430 --> 00:02:25,970 because of that just what money wasn't 37 00:02:20,700 --> 00:02:28,200 there some said that your father study 38 00:02:25,970 --> 00:02:38,660 forestry and others said he studying 39 00:02:28,200 --> 00:02:38,660 microbiology and biochemistry correct 40 00:02:47,000 --> 00:02:52,860 but he left the University of Minnesota 41 00:02:50,060 --> 00:02:54,959 he became head of research from the 42 00:02:52,860 --> 00:02:58,650 American christening company in 43 00:02:54,959 --> 00:03:02,360 Louisville Kentucky and he was there for 44 00:02:58,650 --> 00:03:07,800 several years that's where I was born 45 00:03:02,360 --> 00:03:08,670 yeah and then came to Memphis when he 46 00:03:07,800 --> 00:03:10,830 had a chance 47 00:03:08,670 --> 00:03:12,750 well Chris OD company was shut down 48 00:03:10,830 --> 00:03:14,910 their research department but he also 49 00:03:12,750 --> 00:03:18,180 had a chance to go to work for a 50 00:03:14,910 --> 00:03:20,850 fraternity brother Dale Chapman of 51 00:03:18,180 --> 00:03:23,100 Chapman Chemical Company which was 52 00:03:20,850 --> 00:03:27,330 located at that time that old Brooks 53 00:03:23,100 --> 00:03:31,950 Road here in Memphis so he set up the 54 00:03:27,330 --> 00:03:35,100 manufacturing side of the operation for 55 00:03:31,950 --> 00:03:37,340 Chapman Chemical Company which was just 56 00:03:35,100 --> 00:03:39,900 a marketing company 57 00:03:37,340 --> 00:03:42,720 that's the way they operated during the 58 00:03:39,900 --> 00:03:45,990 war and in fact third or most of their 59 00:03:42,720 --> 00:03:47,100 work was government work prior to 60 00:03:45,990 --> 00:03:48,630 becoming known as Buckman laboratories 61 00:03:47,100 --> 00:03:50,750 the company was called central 62 00:03:48,630 --> 00:03:53,850 lavatories that was that was the 63 00:03:50,750 --> 00:03:57,750 manufacturing I'm not Chapman Chemical 64 00:03:53,850 --> 00:04:00,680 Company and it was after the war that my 65 00:03:57,750 --> 00:04:04,140 dad and dales happens let the blanket 66 00:04:00,680 --> 00:04:17,820 they went his way and dad went his way 67 00:04:04,140 --> 00:04:20,220 and formed the company well most of most 68 00:04:17,820 --> 00:04:25,310 of what they did in Chapman was wood 69 00:04:20,220 --> 00:04:29,280 preservation chemicals when they split 70 00:04:25,310 --> 00:04:31,500 they agreed not to dad agreed not to go 71 00:04:29,280 --> 00:04:34,860 into wood preservation that Dale agreed 72 00:04:31,500 --> 00:04:36,780 not to go into pulp paper industry so it 73 00:04:34,860 --> 00:04:41,730 was just kind of a quid pro quo deal 74 00:04:36,780 --> 00:04:43,860 that's part of their separation it was 75 00:04:41,730 --> 00:04:46,500 it was a good time to start a business 76 00:04:43,860 --> 00:04:49,950 actually because there was demand for 77 00:04:46,500 --> 00:04:51,960 everything your father had a reputation 78 00:04:49,950 --> 00:04:53,610 as being a very hard worker workaholic 79 00:04:51,960 --> 00:04:55,380 and some of the materials reading said 80 00:04:53,610 --> 00:04:57,090 he didn't like to take vacations and one 81 00:04:55,380 --> 00:04:59,850 time one of the only vacations the 82 00:04:57,090 --> 00:05:01,230 report he took was the employees decided 83 00:04:59,850 --> 00:05:03,060 to give him a cruise and he went on a 84 00:05:01,230 --> 00:05:04,260 short cruise for a while and he came 85 00:05:03,060 --> 00:05:05,550 back and reported the best thing about 86 00:05:04,260 --> 00:05:07,260 the cruise is he who go out and look at 87 00:05:05,550 --> 00:05:09,419 the ships boilers just to see how the 88 00:05:07,260 --> 00:05:10,860 ship was operating the talk about your 89 00:05:09,419 --> 00:05:12,720 father is a workaholic as somebody who 90 00:05:10,860 --> 00:05:14,580 really did you know work on the clock 91 00:05:12,720 --> 00:05:17,820 and even stayed over it in the office at 92 00:05:14,580 --> 00:05:19,800 night on occasion yeah you know and part 93 00:05:17,820 --> 00:05:22,880 of it was just the fact that he grew up 94 00:05:19,800 --> 00:05:25,230 with the apartment he grew up in 95 00:05:22,880 --> 00:05:29,130 thinking ahead at that time you had to 96 00:05:25,230 --> 00:05:32,640 be willing to work 1214 hours a day and 97 00:05:29,130 --> 00:05:36,510 that's what he did not maybe he'd work 98 00:05:32,640 --> 00:05:38,070 Saturdays and Sundays yeah I think 99 00:05:36,510 --> 00:05:41,330 whether kindig-it him to go to church 100 00:05:38,070 --> 00:05:44,130 stuff like that but he you know he was 101 00:05:41,330 --> 00:05:45,260 consumed by work there's no question 102 00:05:44,130 --> 00:05:47,210 about 103 00:05:45,260 --> 00:05:49,130 so then in the early years in the mid 104 00:05:47,210 --> 00:05:52,370 1940s I think that's when he met with 105 00:05:49,130 --> 00:05:54,920 Peyton Rhodes now he and Peyton were on 106 00:05:52,370 --> 00:05:56,960 the committee for economic development 107 00:05:54,920 --> 00:06:02,210 or something like that during the war 108 00:05:56,960 --> 00:06:08,780 together here Memphis and you know it 109 00:06:02,210 --> 00:06:13,340 they got to be friends and when we had a 110 00:06:08,780 --> 00:06:17,330 fire down to central laboratories we 111 00:06:13,340 --> 00:06:19,730 needed some space to do some work in the 112 00:06:17,330 --> 00:06:22,790 labs and some people let us use the lab 113 00:06:19,730 --> 00:06:25,120 and then what dad got ready to start his 114 00:06:22,790 --> 00:06:30,410 own business Peyton let him use his labs 115 00:06:25,120 --> 00:06:32,330 just on a handshake deal our first 116 00:06:30,410 --> 00:06:38,960 product was actually invented in Rhodes 117 00:06:32,330 --> 00:06:40,880 College it's a product we no longer sell 118 00:06:38,960 --> 00:06:43,640 because you couldn't sell it today he 119 00:06:40,880 --> 00:06:48,140 was made of phenol McCarrick acetate the 120 00:06:43,640 --> 00:06:50,210 downside to this and that one and those 121 00:06:48,140 --> 00:06:53,090 are all the chlorinated phenols and 122 00:06:50,210 --> 00:06:55,340 there's pretty nasty stuff but it worked 123 00:06:53,090 --> 00:06:56,930 that was the main thing you were looking 124 00:06:55,340 --> 00:06:58,730 for after the war was something that 125 00:06:56,930 --> 00:07:00,650 worked you weren't too concerned about 126 00:06:58,730 --> 00:07:04,520 whether it had a little mercury in it or 127 00:07:00,650 --> 00:07:11,690 a few other things of course that whole 128 00:07:04,520 --> 00:07:13,450 party scared today is related to the 129 00:07:11,690 --> 00:07:16,630 processing of paper 130 00:07:13,450 --> 00:07:18,460 I uh controlled microorganism slime in 131 00:07:16,630 --> 00:07:26,560 the paper mills and the white end of the 132 00:07:18,460 --> 00:07:29,410 machine some other things that was the 133 00:07:26,560 --> 00:07:31,510 product that went out this everybody 134 00:07:29,410 --> 00:07:35,560 started getting scared of handling 135 00:07:31,510 --> 00:07:39,750 mercury but of course many other side 136 00:07:35,560 --> 00:07:45,610 still sold today at mercury you know oh 137 00:07:39,750 --> 00:07:51,970 it's still being used any countries of 138 00:07:45,610 --> 00:08:00,850 the world during the war years even 139 00:07:51,970 --> 00:08:03,640 before so from that handshake well I 140 00:08:00,850 --> 00:08:09,340 don't know much about what they did 141 00:08:03,640 --> 00:08:11,100 after the war fed after the company got 142 00:08:09,340 --> 00:08:13,810 started 143 00:08:11,100 --> 00:08:16,540 I'm sure they still had a relationship 144 00:08:13,810 --> 00:08:22,000 and they still enjoyed each other's 145 00:08:16,540 --> 00:08:25,240 company but as far as me knowing I think 146 00:08:22,000 --> 00:08:26,740 this was before Payton actually became 147 00:08:25,240 --> 00:08:28,540 president I think at this point he was 148 00:08:26,740 --> 00:08:30,040 working he you know still as a physics 149 00:08:28,540 --> 00:08:36,360 professor but also maybe working with 150 00:08:30,040 --> 00:08:41,010 the president's office and with me I 151 00:08:36,360 --> 00:08:41,010 can't answer that I don't know the dates 152 00:08:52,269 --> 00:08:56,990 for the story in terms of your training 153 00:08:55,310 --> 00:08:58,910 as a chemical engineer and then kind of 154 00:08:56,990 --> 00:09:00,860 I want you to talk about were you 155 00:08:58,910 --> 00:09:03,350 determined to be in the family business 156 00:09:00,860 --> 00:09:06,320 I know your father left and Trust and 157 00:09:03,350 --> 00:09:07,579 create a trust and wanted you to you and 158 00:09:06,320 --> 00:09:09,140 your brother to go up in the business 159 00:09:07,579 --> 00:09:10,970 was if you don't mind let's shift gears 160 00:09:09,140 --> 00:09:13,190 and talk about your own then training 161 00:09:10,970 --> 00:09:16,880 and Purdue and Chicago and afterward 162 00:09:13,190 --> 00:09:20,750 well alright my father wanted me to be a 163 00:09:16,880 --> 00:09:22,880 chemist he gave me college-level 164 00:09:20,750 --> 00:09:30,820 chemistry books to read when I was eight 165 00:09:22,880 --> 00:09:33,470 years old you know I had an interesting 166 00:09:30,820 --> 00:09:35,899 really interesting I was more interested 167 00:09:33,470 --> 00:09:45,470 in building things so I wanted to be a 168 00:09:35,899 --> 00:09:47,690 chemical engineer he still thought I 169 00:09:45,470 --> 00:09:52,899 should have a PhD though and Chemical 170 00:09:47,690 --> 00:09:56,810 Engineering I said no I don't think so 171 00:09:52,899 --> 00:09:58,459 really get a masters in business and 172 00:09:56,810 --> 00:10:04,630 that he wanted me to get a PhD in 173 00:09:58,459 --> 00:10:06,829 business I'll tell you one story he 174 00:10:04,630 --> 00:10:08,630 offered to help me move in the 175 00:10:06,829 --> 00:10:11,740 International House the University of 176 00:10:08,630 --> 00:10:11,740 Chicago ma'am 177 00:10:14,070 --> 00:10:20,700 that dinner that night after we moved in 178 00:10:18,260 --> 00:10:22,530 they said oh by the way we have a 179 00:10:20,700 --> 00:10:24,990 meeting with the Dean of the ph.d 180 00:10:22,530 --> 00:10:26,760 program at 10 o'clock tomorrow morning 181 00:10:24,990 --> 00:10:28,980 of course he hadn't told me anything 182 00:10:26,760 --> 00:10:35,100 about it or even asked me about it 183 00:10:28,980 --> 00:10:36,690 we did it so we went saw the Dean and he 184 00:10:35,100 --> 00:10:40,770 listened that they had for about five 185 00:10:36,690 --> 00:10:44,010 minutes mister why should have a PhD he 186 00:10:40,770 --> 00:10:46,440 turned to me and left on his pipe a 187 00:10:44,010 --> 00:10:48,030 couple of times and said you want to go 188 00:10:46,440 --> 00:10:50,670 into business or do you want to do 189 00:10:48,030 --> 00:10:54,540 research and I said go into business you 190 00:10:50,670 --> 00:10:56,370 think you don't work PhD and I think 191 00:10:54,540 --> 00:11:00,720 that was one of the few times my dad was 192 00:10:56,370 --> 00:11:05,220 had a lot of slow words but that Dean 193 00:11:00,720 --> 00:11:07,310 was George Shultz got it straight from 194 00:11:05,220 --> 00:11:10,650 the horse's mouth 195 00:11:07,310 --> 00:11:13,880 and you know they had majored in 196 00:11:10,650 --> 00:11:22,770 statistics that the business school 197 00:11:13,880 --> 00:11:24,600 because I was interested then did you 198 00:11:22,770 --> 00:11:32,670 come back to Memphis immediately after 199 00:11:24,600 --> 00:11:33,990 finishing up at Chicago I came talk 200 00:11:32,670 --> 00:11:36,090 about if you would then your progression 201 00:11:33,990 --> 00:11:39,590 through the ranks of the company ladder 202 00:11:36,090 --> 00:11:39,590 in terms of becoming 203 00:11:49,340 --> 00:12:05,700 gave me that title even you know he was 204 00:11:56,010 --> 00:12:09,150 it was more of a token that's anything 205 00:12:05,700 --> 00:12:12,510 at that point it did a couple years 206 00:12:09,150 --> 00:12:15,990 later our secretary treasurer left the 207 00:12:12,510 --> 00:12:20,010 company so I ended up for reopen you 208 00:12:15,990 --> 00:12:22,860 know then it was serious business but I 209 00:12:20,010 --> 00:12:24,080 spent a lot of time at that time tried 210 00:12:22,860 --> 00:12:28,140 to figure out how to improve 211 00:12:24,080 --> 00:12:31,050 productivity of the company that was 212 00:12:28,140 --> 00:12:33,510 pretty much what I focused on my first 213 00:12:31,050 --> 00:12:37,620 time whether it was manufacturing or 214 00:12:33,510 --> 00:12:43,080 whether was it ain't a processing never 215 00:12:37,620 --> 00:12:49,530 father was in whatever trying to figure 216 00:12:43,080 --> 00:12:50,970 out how you're basically building on 217 00:12:49,530 --> 00:12:52,320 your training then from your graduate 218 00:12:50,970 --> 00:12:54,270 days in terms of employing the 219 00:12:52,320 --> 00:12:58,710 techniques and procedures you learned 220 00:12:54,270 --> 00:13:02,640 there right and then over time I ended 221 00:12:58,710 --> 00:13:04,530 up they had in charge of everything in 222 00:13:02,640 --> 00:13:17,340 the Western Hemisphere outside the 223 00:13:04,530 --> 00:13:20,930 United States international expansion of 224 00:13:17,340 --> 00:13:20,930 the company returned the star phone 225 00:13:26,670 --> 00:13:50,889 we went from two operations or three 226 00:13:31,689 --> 00:13:53,649 operations and from there just kind of 227 00:13:50,889 --> 00:14:01,809 mushroomed out into South Africa to 228 00:13:53,649 --> 00:14:03,939 Brazil I've got a newspaper clipping 229 00:14:01,809 --> 00:14:05,769 from 1979 when you're quoted in The 230 00:14:03,939 --> 00:14:08,139 Commercial Appeal and and your quote is 231 00:14:05,769 --> 00:14:09,759 you know Buckman laboratories was 232 00:14:08,139 --> 00:14:12,160 previously was a domestic company with 233 00:14:09,759 --> 00:14:14,019 some international operations in here's 234 00:14:12,160 --> 00:14:14,980 your cotton but now it's a multinational 235 00:14:14,019 --> 00:14:16,809 firm which happens to have its 236 00:14:14,980 --> 00:14:19,569 headquarters in Memphis and you were 237 00:14:16,809 --> 00:14:22,360 quoted as saying in 1963 we started 238 00:14:19,569 --> 00:14:23,740 becoming an international firm and we 239 00:14:22,360 --> 00:14:26,410 had 15 to 20 percent of our business 240 00:14:23,740 --> 00:14:27,639 outside of the United States and in 1917 241 00:14:26,410 --> 00:14:30,160 then you said today that figure has 242 00:14:27,639 --> 00:14:33,100 jumped to 57 percent so it sounds like 243 00:14:30,160 --> 00:14:49,420 that late 1970s early 1980s was a real 244 00:14:33,100 --> 00:14:51,129 turning point then in terms of so today 245 00:14:49,420 --> 00:14:53,110 I think you have customers in 90 246 00:14:51,129 --> 00:14:55,240 different countries operations in 22 247 00:14:53,110 --> 00:15:00,370 different countries and over 1500 248 00:14:55,240 --> 00:15:02,529 employees talk then about then if we 249 00:15:00,370 --> 00:15:04,480 pick up here the 80s then your growth 250 00:15:02,529 --> 00:15:07,439 from there so you're adding affiliates 251 00:15:04,480 --> 00:15:07,439 and operations overseas 252 00:15:20,649 --> 00:15:27,069 I should we were one of the first 253 00:15:24,850 --> 00:15:33,069 companies to put laptops in the heads 254 00:15:27,069 --> 00:15:35,110 all these people we put together we 255 00:15:33,069 --> 00:15:38,019 cobbled together I guess the best way to 256 00:15:35,110 --> 00:15:42,759 say it a global network piggybacking on 257 00:15:38,019 --> 00:15:47,230 IBM's global network developed the 258 00:15:42,759 --> 00:16:11,050 system for shared knowledge using 259 00:15:47,230 --> 00:16:20,949 laptops we had a chapter 89 we had all 260 00:16:11,050 --> 00:16:23,980 of our people with laptops stayed with 261 00:16:20,949 --> 00:16:28,829 IBM for about five years and then and 262 00:16:23,980 --> 00:16:31,949 the early nineties with CompuServe and 263 00:16:28,829 --> 00:16:35,470 simplified the system considerably and 264 00:16:31,949 --> 00:16:40,660 put in what they call now enterprise 265 00:16:35,470 --> 00:16:45,490 social networks to be able to go across 266 00:16:40,660 --> 00:16:49,499 the silos in the organization and by 267 00:16:45,490 --> 00:16:52,899 being able to move knowledge fast where 268 00:16:49,499 --> 00:17:00,249 meaningful when it was needed we could 269 00:16:52,899 --> 00:17:02,110 redefine the competitive equation so 270 00:17:00,249 --> 00:17:03,999 you've built a national international 271 00:17:02,110 --> 00:17:05,500 reputation for knowledge sharing if you 272 00:17:03,999 --> 00:17:07,299 had to describe to a student who's 273 00:17:05,500 --> 00:17:08,649 encountering this term in business 274 00:17:07,299 --> 00:17:12,329 school for the first time how would you 275 00:17:08,649 --> 00:17:12,329 describe or define knowledge sharing 276 00:17:23,730 --> 00:17:30,030 you seek knowledge if you need it you 277 00:17:27,839 --> 00:17:33,360 don't seek knowledge just for knowledge 278 00:17:30,030 --> 00:17:37,500 sake maybe some of you professors do but 279 00:17:33,360 --> 00:17:39,840 most things though most of us you know 280 00:17:37,500 --> 00:17:43,679 we're looking for a knowledge to solve a 281 00:17:39,840 --> 00:17:47,760 problem of some kind our case it was 282 00:17:43,679 --> 00:17:50,010 customer problems the speed at which we 283 00:17:47,760 --> 00:17:53,190 can solve a customer problems became 284 00:17:50,010 --> 00:17:54,030 very important for us being able to 285 00:17:53,190 --> 00:17:57,840 compete 286 00:17:54,030 --> 00:18:00,299 it was redefining that speed that on a 287 00:17:57,840 --> 00:18:03,630 global basis that gave us the big 288 00:18:00,299 --> 00:18:04,860 competitive edge what gave the idea to 289 00:18:03,630 --> 00:18:08,790 write the book building a knowledge 290 00:18:04,860 --> 00:18:11,390 driven organization I was asked to do it 291 00:18:08,790 --> 00:18:11,390 by mcgraw-hill 292 00:18:11,840 --> 00:18:18,780 it certainly wasn't high on my list 293 00:18:14,220 --> 00:18:22,790 until they came along because writing 294 00:18:18,780 --> 00:18:26,850 for me as a struggle it's not easy 295 00:18:22,790 --> 00:18:27,750 really work what kind of feedback did 296 00:18:26,850 --> 00:18:29,549 you give what kind of how did that 297 00:18:27,750 --> 00:18:32,010 change at all having offer the book in 298 00:18:29,549 --> 00:18:36,690 terms of notoriety or in terms of people 299 00:18:32,010 --> 00:18:44,040 looking to you for information what what 300 00:18:36,690 --> 00:18:50,010 happened was after we started doing yes 301 00:18:44,040 --> 00:18:54,450 and put in our global assistance there 302 00:18:50,010 --> 00:18:57,559 was a chap in Denver who was putting 303 00:18:54,450 --> 00:18:57,559 together a seminar on 304 00:18:58,730 --> 00:19:03,570 it was just the very early stage that 305 00:19:01,680 --> 00:19:06,510 simply we didn't even know what to call 306 00:19:03,570 --> 00:19:08,940 it they but he was a seminar talking 307 00:19:06,510 --> 00:19:12,510 about computer networks that sort of 308 00:19:08,940 --> 00:19:16,860 thing there was a few folks that got 309 00:19:12,510 --> 00:19:19,910 involved dick mom Bush from us West he 310 00:19:16,860 --> 00:19:23,280 put the seven hard first one together 311 00:19:19,910 --> 00:19:25,290 attended was folks like Brook Manville 312 00:19:23,280 --> 00:19:31,200 who subsequently became chief knowledge 313 00:19:25,290 --> 00:19:35,580 officer at McKenzie and he had 314 00:19:31,200 --> 00:19:39,870 independent consultant and some others 315 00:19:35,580 --> 00:19:42,090 and I was one of the got national 316 00:19:39,870 --> 00:19:45,510 keynote speakers and try to tell folks 317 00:19:42,090 --> 00:19:47,880 how do you do this stuff that we were 318 00:19:45,510 --> 00:19:50,700 all feeling our way we were all trying 319 00:19:47,880 --> 00:19:52,830 to figure out how to make it work and 320 00:19:50,700 --> 00:19:56,820 you know this was the very early days of 321 00:19:52,830 --> 00:20:03,780 email very early days of forums and so 322 00:19:56,820 --> 00:20:06,480 forth you know nobody had a good network 323 00:20:03,780 --> 00:20:09,810 for email on a global basis there was no 324 00:20:06,480 --> 00:20:12,150 internet then so you couldn't depend on 325 00:20:09,810 --> 00:20:21,930 the Internet to move stuff like you do 326 00:20:12,150 --> 00:20:24,330 now so you had to create your own you 327 00:20:21,930 --> 00:20:28,020 know we even tried to create an intranet 328 00:20:24,330 --> 00:20:31,380 using the mainframe that was a very 329 00:20:28,020 --> 00:20:35,850 painful process but we learned you know 330 00:20:31,380 --> 00:20:37,740 what we wanted in our intranet and when 331 00:20:35,850 --> 00:20:39,720 the internet came along all of a sudden 332 00:20:37,740 --> 00:20:44,040 we just moved from one system to the 333 00:20:39,720 --> 00:20:45,720 other beautifully did you have any 334 00:20:44,040 --> 00:20:46,590 interaction with the Pentagon or you 335 00:20:45,720 --> 00:20:48,870 know who was involved 336 00:20:46,590 --> 00:20:51,450 oh there's any government contracts I'm 337 00:20:48,870 --> 00:20:53,100 not really insulting more there's more 338 00:20:51,450 --> 00:21:00,660 speaking to other business leaders 339 00:20:53,100 --> 00:21:02,690 around the world so 250 tabs around the 340 00:21:00,660 --> 00:21:05,850 world at various places 341 00:21:02,690 --> 00:21:08,790 there's just wherever you get invited to 342 00:21:05,850 --> 00:21:12,720 go I didn't push it cuz I had write a 343 00:21:08,790 --> 00:21:14,970 full time job - well shift in that 344 00:21:12,720 --> 00:21:17,070 full-time job if you could you describe 345 00:21:14,970 --> 00:21:18,150 your philosophy of leadership I won't 346 00:21:17,070 --> 00:21:20,250 talk for a few minutes about leadership 347 00:21:18,150 --> 00:21:25,250 tell us if you have a philosophy of 348 00:21:20,250 --> 00:21:29,460 leadership and what that would be well a 349 00:21:25,250 --> 00:21:35,160 lot of leaders you know they you've got 350 00:21:29,460 --> 00:21:37,590 a group of people and other leaders 351 00:21:35,160 --> 00:21:41,520 trying oh those people into what they 352 00:21:37,590 --> 00:21:44,070 want I was more interested in finding 353 00:21:41,520 --> 00:21:47,790 out what the people wanted and where 354 00:21:44,070 --> 00:21:50,190 they wanted to go and then tried to 355 00:21:47,790 --> 00:21:52,640 eliminate the roadblocks that they're 356 00:21:50,190 --> 00:21:55,710 getting where they wanted to go because 357 00:21:52,640 --> 00:22:00,240 if I could help them grow to be the best 358 00:21:55,710 --> 00:22:03,060 that they could be and that was really 359 00:22:00,240 --> 00:22:08,900 based on their attributes their their 360 00:22:03,060 --> 00:22:11,220 desires their training etc then I 361 00:22:08,900 --> 00:22:12,960 eliminated a bunch of roadblocks that 362 00:22:11,220 --> 00:22:17,640 are in their way and then if they work 363 00:22:12,960 --> 00:22:20,490 harder that's true they will many other 364 00:22:17,640 --> 00:22:23,220 leaders look at it differently and say 365 00:22:20,490 --> 00:22:24,900 well we've got Johnny here and Johnny's 366 00:22:23,220 --> 00:22:27,840 deficient in these things we need to 367 00:22:24,900 --> 00:22:30,060 correct that so he's better well that 368 00:22:27,840 --> 00:22:33,080 really doesn't pay very well that 369 00:22:30,060 --> 00:22:35,190 doesn't get you very far 370 00:22:33,080 --> 00:22:38,910 because then you've tried to make people 371 00:22:35,190 --> 00:22:40,830 into something they're not and all of us 372 00:22:38,910 --> 00:22:44,190 are different all of us have different 373 00:22:40,830 --> 00:22:46,260 actions have different abilities so I 374 00:22:44,190 --> 00:22:48,870 just tried to maximize everybody's 375 00:22:46,260 --> 00:22:51,720 ability to the best that they could be 376 00:22:48,870 --> 00:22:55,110 and you know from that we figured out 377 00:22:51,720 --> 00:22:57,480 what they should be doing and trying to 378 00:22:55,110 --> 00:23:00,150 help them work in that direction and 379 00:22:57,480 --> 00:23:01,530 what they wanted to do in terms of your 380 00:23:00,150 --> 00:23:03,270 leadership style would you say you've 381 00:23:01,530 --> 00:23:05,700 picked this up from others perhaps your 382 00:23:03,270 --> 00:23:08,160 father or is this something no I don't 383 00:23:05,700 --> 00:23:09,840 know where I got this but basically it 384 00:23:08,160 --> 00:23:12,300 was just one of opening windows and 385 00:23:09,840 --> 00:23:13,140 doors for others let them do what they 386 00:23:12,300 --> 00:23:15,750 did 387 00:23:13,140 --> 00:23:18,620 and you'd be amazed what people will do 388 00:23:15,750 --> 00:23:18,620 if you give them that chance 389 00:23:18,980 --> 00:23:24,330 when you became CEO in 1978 your father 390 00:23:22,350 --> 00:23:25,890 passed away prematurely do you think 391 00:23:24,330 --> 00:23:28,040 were you ready to be CEO at that point 392 00:23:25,890 --> 00:23:31,470 or is that a job you had to learn oh 393 00:23:28,040 --> 00:23:33,960 well I was at that time I was running 394 00:23:31,470 --> 00:23:37,020 things outside the US and in the Western 395 00:23:33,960 --> 00:23:38,610 Hemisphere already and participated the 396 00:23:37,020 --> 00:23:41,220 rest of it so I had a pretty good 397 00:23:38,610 --> 00:23:46,320 knowledge of all the pieces that were 398 00:23:41,220 --> 00:23:51,570 involved you know when you predecessor 399 00:23:46,320 --> 00:23:53,160 dies unexpectedly you always wish you 400 00:23:51,570 --> 00:23:56,100 could go back and ask him a few 401 00:23:53,160 --> 00:23:57,960 questions and that type of thing but you 402 00:23:56,100 --> 00:24:03,179 know it was I was just ready in the end 403 00:23:57,960 --> 00:24:05,910 I was gonna be correctly because I'd 404 00:24:03,179 --> 00:24:10,290 been in the business by then quite a 405 00:24:05,910 --> 00:24:11,580 while in terms of leadership than any 406 00:24:10,290 --> 00:24:13,230 advice you would give to students 407 00:24:11,580 --> 00:24:15,450 today's students graduated from college 408 00:24:13,230 --> 00:24:17,970 starting their careers post college 409 00:24:15,450 --> 00:24:19,350 occurs about you know lessons from 410 00:24:17,970 --> 00:24:22,710 leadership that you would impart to 411 00:24:19,350 --> 00:24:26,910 students just follow your dreams don't 412 00:24:22,710 --> 00:24:29,160 try to be somebody you're not try to 413 00:24:26,910 --> 00:24:33,030 maximize your own attributes or whatever 414 00:24:29,160 --> 00:24:35,510 they are just being the best achievement 415 00:24:33,030 --> 00:24:38,100 they didn't go for it 416 00:24:35,510 --> 00:24:42,179 do what you want to do not what somebody 417 00:24:38,100 --> 00:24:44,070 else wants you to do okay can we take a 418 00:24:42,179 --> 00:24:46,410 break for just a minute what I'd like to 419 00:24:44,070 --> 00:24:49,110 do then is now if we could shift gears 420 00:24:46,410 --> 00:24:51,000 and talk about now roads and some of the 421 00:24:49,110 --> 00:24:52,860 names on that list like Jim dog rule and 422 00:24:51,000 --> 00:24:55,320 all that do you want to take a break or 423 00:24:52,860 --> 00:24:58,140 stand up and stretch or do you I'm fine 424 00:24:55,320 --> 00:25:01,690 I can I can keep going I gotta get home 425 00:24:58,140 --> 00:25:04,430 so I can have a swim okay okay 426 00:25:01,690 --> 00:25:06,980 all right what I'd like to start with it 427 00:25:04,430 --> 00:25:08,750 as we get started is asking about when 428 00:25:06,980 --> 00:25:10,370 you first came onto the roads board of 429 00:25:08,750 --> 00:25:13,010 trustees and talked about your time as a 430 00:25:10,370 --> 00:25:15,200 trustee or even if you want to go back 431 00:25:13,010 --> 00:25:17,150 to even your first your recollections of 432 00:25:15,200 --> 00:25:18,740 your first interaction at the college 433 00:25:17,150 --> 00:25:20,840 with whoever that would have been at the 434 00:25:18,740 --> 00:25:25,360 time whether it's Jim Dodd really two 435 00:25:20,840 --> 00:25:28,309 before Jim daughter all right yeah I 436 00:25:25,360 --> 00:25:31,400 came on the board when my father passed 437 00:25:28,309 --> 00:25:33,170 away and they asked me if I would be 438 00:25:31,400 --> 00:25:40,460 interested in coming on the board I said 439 00:25:33,170 --> 00:25:43,940 yes it was Walter Armstrong who called 440 00:25:40,460 --> 00:25:50,960 me I guess he was on the committee she 441 00:25:43,940 --> 00:25:54,290 was and you know my interest was got to 442 00:25:50,960 --> 00:25:59,390 be more of a development nature rather 443 00:25:54,290 --> 00:26:03,260 than anything else and big part of that 444 00:25:59,390 --> 00:26:05,179 was done line backs influence and he and 445 00:26:03,260 --> 00:26:08,809 I became very good friends over the 446 00:26:05,179 --> 00:26:14,600 years practice youngest daughters my 447 00:26:08,809 --> 00:26:19,070 guts out you know quite a ways back but 448 00:26:14,600 --> 00:26:20,690 you know we someway somehow and I just 449 00:26:19,070 --> 00:26:24,410 still don't remember how this happened 450 00:26:20,690 --> 00:26:27,710 but I ended up being in charge of the 451 00:26:24,410 --> 00:26:33,020 development committee and then I got 452 00:26:27,710 --> 00:26:36,309 assigned to take on this campaign that 453 00:26:33,020 --> 00:26:39,830 was ten or twenty million dollar go 454 00:26:36,309 --> 00:26:41,150 don't forget that we tried to figure out 455 00:26:39,830 --> 00:26:44,110 well how are we going to get twenty 456 00:26:41,150 --> 00:26:44,110 million dollars and 457 00:26:45,450 --> 00:26:50,380 basically what we did we put together a 458 00:26:47,980 --> 00:26:53,320 group of five trustees that were willing 459 00:26:50,380 --> 00:27:01,120 to pledge five million dollars if it was 460 00:26:53,320 --> 00:27:03,940 matched to four one and of course that's 461 00:27:01,120 --> 00:27:07,960 me bet the goal almost instantaneously 462 00:27:03,940 --> 00:27:10,360 as soon as it was matched and I time we 463 00:27:07,960 --> 00:27:11,950 quit that campaign doubted I'd gotten 464 00:27:10,360 --> 00:27:16,870 the total up to over a hundred million 465 00:27:11,950 --> 00:27:18,250 so we felt pretty good about anyways 466 00:27:16,870 --> 00:27:20,740 that was fun 467 00:27:18,250 --> 00:27:24,000 do you recall who the five trustees were 468 00:27:20,740 --> 00:27:24,000 at that time who you'd ask the last 469 00:27:25,890 --> 00:27:32,380 anonymous okay I'm gonna break that wood 470 00:27:30,240 --> 00:27:34,300 it's your friendship with Don line back 471 00:27:32,380 --> 00:27:35,860 started after you became on the board so 472 00:27:34,300 --> 00:27:40,000 you have to know run through his work at 473 00:27:35,860 --> 00:27:41,590 the college and element yeah yeah did 474 00:27:40,000 --> 00:27:46,330 you ever do you ever chair the board 475 00:27:41,590 --> 00:27:53,050 no I walked to chair the boy I had 476 00:27:46,330 --> 00:27:54,520 enough deal with or what would you say 477 00:27:53,050 --> 00:27:55,929 is your greatest satisfaction over the 478 00:27:54,520 --> 00:27:58,679 years in working with the Rhodes Board 479 00:27:55,929 --> 00:27:58,679 of Trustees Oh 480 00:28:00,510 --> 00:28:06,960 keeping it international studies alive 481 00:28:03,870 --> 00:28:11,280 when they was a period there when 482 00:28:06,960 --> 00:28:11,280 someone get going 483 00:28:12,350 --> 00:28:20,490 you know it roads unique or certainly 484 00:28:18,360 --> 00:28:23,330 was unique and was the only 485 00:28:20,490 --> 00:28:28,940 undergraduate institution that had a 486 00:28:23,330 --> 00:28:28,940 Department of International Studies and 487 00:28:29,330 --> 00:28:40,460 they had influence far beyond their size 488 00:28:34,580 --> 00:28:40,460 through folks like PK seen but most like 489 00:28:41,330 --> 00:28:48,030 John copper looks like Andrew Victor you 490 00:28:45,840 --> 00:28:50,550 know people don't realize just how 491 00:28:48,030 --> 00:28:54,480 influential most of those those 492 00:28:50,550 --> 00:28:57,360 individuals were that were all did the 493 00:28:54,480 --> 00:28:59,550 International Studies side of the 494 00:28:57,360 --> 00:29:05,370 equation and it was the only area they 495 00:28:59,550 --> 00:29:07,500 were interested in I'm afraid too many 496 00:29:05,370 --> 00:29:09,810 of the liberal arts community viewed the 497 00:29:07,500 --> 00:29:12,240 International Studies it's a foreign 498 00:29:09,810 --> 00:29:15,240 group that shouldn't belong on the 499 00:29:12,240 --> 00:29:20,010 campus at least that was the condition 500 00:29:15,240 --> 00:29:24,230 for a while so just trying to keep that 501 00:29:20,010 --> 00:29:24,230 going it alive was somebody 502 00:29:24,780 --> 00:29:28,860 as a member of the board trustees you 503 00:29:27,570 --> 00:29:30,600 mentioned this group didn't want to keep 504 00:29:28,860 --> 00:29:31,800 that going did you feel limited in a 505 00:29:30,600 --> 00:29:34,050 sense that you were a board member or 506 00:29:31,800 --> 00:29:35,790 did you feel empowered as a board member 507 00:29:34,050 --> 00:29:36,450 to be able to keep it alive and keep it 508 00:29:35,790 --> 00:29:39,170 going strong 509 00:29:36,450 --> 00:29:49,830 we felt like we were being put in a box 510 00:29:39,170 --> 00:29:51,540 frankly finish that it's influence you 511 00:29:49,830 --> 00:29:55,350 know some of us tried to get a master's 512 00:29:51,540 --> 00:29:57,330 program started at one time and there 513 00:29:55,350 --> 00:30:00,410 were restrictions all the rest of the 514 00:29:57,330 --> 00:30:06,420 faculty put on the thing just killed it 515 00:30:00,410 --> 00:30:08,730 couldn't make it go it wasn't the 516 00:30:06,420 --> 00:30:12,510 question but they they wouldn't 517 00:30:08,730 --> 00:30:15,660 encourage us to move innovative 518 00:30:12,510 --> 00:30:17,430 directions let's put it that way earlier 519 00:30:15,660 --> 00:30:18,960 I asked you about how you direct your 520 00:30:17,430 --> 00:30:20,220 greatest satisfaction serving on the 521 00:30:18,960 --> 00:30:21,600 Board of Trustees over the years in 522 00:30:20,220 --> 00:30:22,800 working with the college let's look at 523 00:30:21,600 --> 00:30:24,300 the other side then what would you see 524 00:30:22,800 --> 00:30:26,310 is your greatest disappointment or your 525 00:30:24,300 --> 00:30:28,200 greatest sense of dissatisfaction or 526 00:30:26,310 --> 00:30:32,580 perhaps even failure I think the 527 00:30:28,200 --> 00:30:36,450 greatest failure was that we never found 528 00:30:32,580 --> 00:30:40,140 a way to take national studies to where 529 00:30:36,450 --> 00:30:44,580 we water to take it we just ran into too 530 00:30:40,140 --> 00:30:45,960 many roadblocks faculty Franklin do you 531 00:30:44,580 --> 00:30:47,430 think that the faculty roadblocks with 532 00:30:45,960 --> 00:30:48,840 what was the greatest reason why it 533 00:30:47,430 --> 00:30:53,340 didn't get to where you'd want to take 534 00:30:48,840 --> 00:30:55,080 it yeah in addition to creating a 535 00:30:53,340 --> 00:30:56,400 master's program what would talk about 536 00:30:55,080 --> 00:30:58,590 your vision for International Studies 537 00:30:56,400 --> 00:31:00,800 particularly in the late 70s when you 538 00:30:58,590 --> 00:31:10,710 came onto the board and the plans were 539 00:31:00,800 --> 00:31:13,440 1980s I didn't have you know if we're 540 00:31:10,710 --> 00:31:16,500 gonna by then we were pretty much a 541 00:31:13,440 --> 00:31:18,300 global organization and you know we saw 542 00:31:16,500 --> 00:31:20,130 the handwriting on the wall if you got 543 00:31:18,300 --> 00:31:23,010 to be a player going into the future you 544 00:31:20,130 --> 00:31:24,750 got to be part of a global citizenry and 545 00:31:23,010 --> 00:31:29,010 you got to be able to function in that 546 00:31:24,750 --> 00:31:31,670 environment if you don't and you're not 547 00:31:29,010 --> 00:31:31,670 gonna be a player 548 00:31:33,669 --> 00:31:42,130 that was a large part of what PK and I a 549 00:31:39,500 --> 00:31:46,399 few others were trying to create was 550 00:31:42,130 --> 00:31:48,769 more of a realization that that and I 551 00:31:46,399 --> 00:31:53,990 just part of the problem was we were you 552 00:31:48,769 --> 00:31:57,529 know 15 years ahead of our time now 553 00:31:53,990 --> 00:31:59,830 there's more realization to that but we 554 00:31:57,529 --> 00:32:02,269 can see it coming and we were trying to 555 00:31:59,830 --> 00:32:04,850 expand the International Studies to 556 00:32:02,269 --> 00:32:09,649 where he could play a bigger role and 557 00:32:04,850 --> 00:32:11,600 help me with that now that it's 2012 as 558 00:32:09,649 --> 00:32:13,549 that vision changed or what's your 559 00:32:11,600 --> 00:32:15,169 vision from this point moving forward 560 00:32:13,549 --> 00:32:20,990 for International Studies for example at 561 00:32:15,169 --> 00:32:25,100 the college well if our citizenry does 562 00:32:20,990 --> 00:32:28,399 not understand other countries either 563 00:32:25,100 --> 00:32:31,929 through daily interaction with other 564 00:32:28,399 --> 00:32:40,250 students from other countries or through 565 00:32:31,929 --> 00:32:41,750 formal study of other countries they're 566 00:32:40,250 --> 00:32:44,169 going to be in the backwater of the 567 00:32:41,750 --> 00:32:44,169 future 568 00:32:44,269 --> 00:32:51,259 correctly it's not enough to study 569 00:32:48,799 --> 00:32:53,029 philosophy and hope everything's got to 570 00:32:51,259 --> 00:32:55,519 work out all right if you don't 571 00:32:53,029 --> 00:33:04,159 understand the context in which you're 572 00:32:55,519 --> 00:33:06,440 operating it's increasingly important 573 00:33:04,159 --> 00:33:09,889 that our students understand that 574 00:33:06,440 --> 00:33:11,899 context because frankly and before they 575 00:33:09,889 --> 00:33:13,849 come to college they have relatively 576 00:33:11,899 --> 00:33:20,349 little contact with people from other 577 00:33:13,849 --> 00:33:20,349 countries and this is where it starts 578 00:33:20,950 --> 00:33:27,709 where we've gotten to today we've got 579 00:33:24,950 --> 00:33:33,519 what little over 5% of students body 580 00:33:27,709 --> 00:33:36,679 here is international now and you know 581 00:33:33,519 --> 00:33:39,679 probably should be voted like 10 percent 582 00:33:36,679 --> 00:33:42,950 better if you really want a critical 583 00:33:39,679 --> 00:33:45,169 mass that will influence and you know 584 00:33:42,950 --> 00:33:49,190 let the people experience for this life 585 00:33:45,169 --> 00:33:50,450 to be part of a world community and it 586 00:33:49,190 --> 00:33:52,099 sounds like it's not just International 587 00:33:50,450 --> 00:33:53,269 Studies majors it's it's every student 588 00:33:52,099 --> 00:33:54,379 on the campus having a some sort of 589 00:33:53,269 --> 00:33:57,169 international perspective our global 590 00:33:54,379 --> 00:34:00,519 perspective it's all I mean if you're 591 00:33:57,169 --> 00:34:03,330 not a global player to college graduate 592 00:34:00,519 --> 00:34:07,560 you've missed something 593 00:34:03,330 --> 00:34:09,270 you really have because you've got to be 594 00:34:07,560 --> 00:34:14,730 a global player whether you want to be 595 00:34:09,270 --> 00:34:18,240 or not afterwards it's just that's just 596 00:34:14,730 --> 00:34:20,370 facts alive earlier you mentioned a 597 00:34:18,240 --> 00:34:22,650 couple of names PK Seidman John copper 598 00:34:20,370 --> 00:34:24,600 Andrew Magna if you would reflect a 599 00:34:22,650 --> 00:34:26,340 little bit upon your your friendship and 600 00:34:24,600 --> 00:34:27,600 your associations with PK Seidman over 601 00:34:26,340 --> 00:34:32,940 the years it tell us a bit about PK 602 00:34:27,600 --> 00:34:36,390 Seidman AKC of the Seidman brothers who 603 00:34:32,940 --> 00:34:43,440 started what is that video seaman at 604 00:34:36,390 --> 00:34:46,650 that time he was semen semen and he came 605 00:34:43,440 --> 00:34:48,330 to Memphis in the 1930s live did 606 00:34:46,650 --> 00:34:52,170 Kimbrough towers which is still standing 607 00:34:48,330 --> 00:34:55,170 over there on Union Avenue man walk to 608 00:34:52,170 --> 00:34:57,540 work downtown every day and wore nice 609 00:34:55,170 --> 00:35:02,220 white carnation in his lapel every day 610 00:34:57,540 --> 00:35:05,670 and it's quite a character but he was a 611 00:35:02,220 --> 00:35:09,750 great visionary he understood 612 00:35:05,670 --> 00:35:14,300 International Studies he understood the 613 00:35:09,750 --> 00:35:17,610 importance of being a global player and 614 00:35:14,300 --> 00:35:19,980 he started the Frankie seabird award and 615 00:35:17,610 --> 00:35:24,810 political economy which was one of the 616 00:35:19,980 --> 00:35:27,240 top awards and probably second after the 617 00:35:24,810 --> 00:35:31,140 Nobel Prize in Economics is first and 618 00:35:27,240 --> 00:35:34,610 award for economist and he brought world 619 00:35:31,140 --> 00:35:41,400 renowned economists to this campus 620 00:35:34,610 --> 00:35:43,830 annual basis and he was frankly I don't 621 00:35:41,400 --> 00:35:45,970 think was nearly as appreciated as he 622 00:35:43,830 --> 00:35:48,890 should have been 623 00:35:45,970 --> 00:35:53,930 because he literally put roads on the 624 00:35:48,890 --> 00:35:57,650 international map long before anybody 625 00:35:53,930 --> 00:35:59,059 thought about it very much earlier 626 00:35:57,650 --> 00:36:00,079 outside he told me a story you're having 627 00:35:59,059 --> 00:36:05,869 dinner with a couple of notable 628 00:36:00,079 --> 00:36:07,490 economists oh yeah sure that was we were 629 00:36:05,869 --> 00:36:09,859 having our annual meeting we had a 630 00:36:07,490 --> 00:36:12,020 meeting annually and I was all the board 631 00:36:09,859 --> 00:36:14,210 and gym doors of the board there was a 632 00:36:12,020 --> 00:36:16,430 few others piqué was on the board and 633 00:36:14,210 --> 00:36:20,930 Bill Seidman was on the board there were 634 00:36:16,430 --> 00:36:23,599 some others and each year we had her 635 00:36:20,930 --> 00:36:26,180 this group of political economists would 636 00:36:23,599 --> 00:36:28,099 come to Memphis and we did presentations 637 00:36:26,180 --> 00:36:30,559 and talks and so forth and we'd have a 638 00:36:28,099 --> 00:36:35,329 dinner well this time we were having the 639 00:36:30,559 --> 00:36:37,970 dinner in the rat over here and my Joyce 640 00:36:35,329 --> 00:36:42,740 and I my wife but I was sitting at a 641 00:36:37,970 --> 00:36:46,970 table with James Tobin Robert Solow and 642 00:36:42,740 --> 00:36:50,270 Kenneth arrow the three Nobel laureates 643 00:36:46,970 --> 00:36:53,540 in economics and we were sitting there 644 00:36:50,270 --> 00:36:55,549 and the conversation between us lasted 645 00:36:53,540 --> 00:36:58,040 about three or four minutes and then it 646 00:36:55,549 --> 00:36:59,450 went off in a direction that choice that 647 00:36:58,040 --> 00:37:01,730 I just looked at each other and said 648 00:36:59,450 --> 00:37:04,670 well we'd better just talk to ourselves 649 00:37:01,730 --> 00:37:06,619 now because we had no clue what they 650 00:37:04,670 --> 00:37:09,500 were talking about they were way over 651 00:37:06,619 --> 00:37:11,170 our heads but I mean there was kind of 652 00:37:09,500 --> 00:37:15,230 people that got brought to this campus 653 00:37:11,170 --> 00:37:16,970 Laura Daniel myself what was his 654 00:37:15,230 --> 00:37:19,130 original connection to Rhodes right he 655 00:37:16,970 --> 00:37:21,079 moved to Memphis I know in the 1930s how 656 00:37:19,130 --> 00:37:25,930 did he initially get I don't know how 657 00:37:21,079 --> 00:37:29,329 that goes back way before my time and I 658 00:37:25,930 --> 00:37:31,849 had the distinct honor to be able to 659 00:37:29,329 --> 00:37:35,260 speak at his funeral but service which 660 00:37:31,849 --> 00:37:35,260 was held right here on campus 661 00:37:38,600 --> 00:37:45,920 but I don't know Jim Dover could 662 00:37:44,360 --> 00:37:47,960 probably tell you more than I could 663 00:37:45,920 --> 00:37:50,720 because he had a lot more contact with 664 00:37:47,960 --> 00:37:52,220 pique it's another name I want asked 665 00:37:50,720 --> 00:37:53,570 about Jim dodge rope you talk about your 666 00:37:52,220 --> 00:37:55,700 relationship with Jim Dogville over the 667 00:37:53,570 --> 00:37:57,550 years and how you know he may have 668 00:37:55,700 --> 00:38:01,670 helped you and you guys work together as 669 00:37:57,550 --> 00:38:05,210 leading the college well Jim there was a 670 00:38:01,670 --> 00:38:09,590 unique guy you know what he came to 671 00:38:05,210 --> 00:38:14,780 Rhodes Rhodes was going broke they were 672 00:38:09,590 --> 00:38:16,280 in financial difficulty he was came out 673 00:38:14,780 --> 00:38:20,930 of the carpet business became a 674 00:38:16,280 --> 00:38:24,640 Presbyterian minister ended up as 675 00:38:20,930 --> 00:38:28,610 Preston Rhodes College and a young age 676 00:38:24,640 --> 00:38:35,840 and at that time Southwestern at Memphis 677 00:38:28,610 --> 00:38:37,600 and you know he was an unusual guy he 678 00:38:35,840 --> 00:38:40,880 brought values 679 00:38:37,600 --> 00:38:44,360 he brought discipline from the financial 680 00:38:40,880 --> 00:38:49,010 standpoint and you know within a year we 681 00:38:44,360 --> 00:38:52,150 the black going again as an institution 682 00:38:49,010 --> 00:38:53,870 but before that trend was not good so 683 00:38:52,150 --> 00:38:56,240 something was a pretty quick turnaround 684 00:38:53,870 --> 00:38:58,700 I think he arrived in Memphis in 1973 685 00:38:56,240 --> 00:39:00,350 became president in 1973 so in a short 686 00:38:58,700 --> 00:39:05,300 time it sounds like a very short proved 687 00:39:00,350 --> 00:39:08,570 me turned with leg around it was it was 688 00:39:05,300 --> 00:39:11,000 quite a feat he frankly made some 689 00:39:08,570 --> 00:39:17,090 enemies in the process but he got it 690 00:39:11,000 --> 00:39:18,380 done I was important he had been the I 691 00:39:17,090 --> 00:39:20,450 believe chief development officer for 692 00:39:18,380 --> 00:39:21,860 the Second Presbyterian Church before 693 00:39:20,450 --> 00:39:24,080 coming to Rouen so he had had some 694 00:39:21,860 --> 00:39:26,600 experience in development and with the 695 00:39:24,080 --> 00:39:28,370 Presbyterian Church 696 00:39:26,600 --> 00:39:31,010 have you had any connection of the 697 00:39:28,370 --> 00:39:35,450 presbyterian church or any nothing at 698 00:39:31,010 --> 00:39:40,010 all so that was Jim I ended up I was an 699 00:39:35,450 --> 00:39:42,040 elder at one time I became inactive that 700 00:39:40,010 --> 00:39:47,770 was a long time ago 701 00:39:42,040 --> 00:39:51,970 ding command of the older actually but I 702 00:39:47,770 --> 00:39:51,970 gave that up some time ago